Let's all go to War Memorial and watch 5 state games in a two day period. It's time to come out of the dark ages. The schools can host through the semi's. We do it for every other sport. Then each team gets to play on a good surface and everything is neutral.

Couldn't agree more.. I would also rather have it the old way then have a preset conference host.

Great idea. As a fan, I would love to see all 5 championship games in a two day event at one location. May have to bundle up and have some hot chocolate, but why not take advantage of the largess of the University and use their facility?

NO! Let's keep state championship games in our local communities. Last year's Jackson/Buffalo game is a fantastic example.... overflow crowds and a game for the ages that generated so much local excitement for Jackson. Visit with locals today and you will find that the game its talked about constantly. The fact is MOST of the thousands that went to their local state championship games last year would not have traveled to Laramie, Casper or anywhere else. You cannot match the excitement that is generated in Powell, Worland, Riverton, Star Valley, Wind River, Casper, Cheyenne.... or any local community when it hosts a state championship football game.

I got to take my dad to a state championship game a few years ago and it was a classic. He wouldn't have traveled out-of-town to watch it, but he did go to watch his friend's grand kids, and we talked about that great game many times for the rest of his life.

To take away the enthusiasm and excitement that is generated for a local community when it hosts a state championship game football game in Wyoming for the sake of a few hundred fans that may watch more than one of the games at a central site would be sad.

Having a state championship at your community is wonderful, but with the system they just put in it's even less of a chance to host the state championship. You could be the number 4 team in the state and end up hosting, when the number one team is still playing. The whole system is a little flawed. It should be at War Memorial. I've posted on this numerous times, and the major problem is travel, but a team has to travel anyway and usually a long ways. The communities will come an support. I've been part of two state championship games where they were both away from my community, and each time my community had just as many people at the game as did the host site. I truly believe it's a good thing and I wish the the WHSAA would just try it out. Nothing has to be set in stone. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work, then go back to the old system. Its a neutral site and its a D1 field. The perfect place for a state championship.

I agree with D.E. and diehard. My rangers have won two out of the last three titles and have hosted through the entire playoffs. It is great to have the playoffs in your town but I think the kids would have loved to have gone to the War and played on the terf. Also it would give everybody a chance to see all of the other games. Last year was a great example. Orange, your game there in Jackson sounded like an awesome game. There are thousands of fans around the state who would have loved to have witnessed it along side of you. Let the higher seeds host the first two rounds then take the championships to Laramie. The travel argument doesn't hold water in Wyoming. Everyone travels from 3-5 hours every other weekend or so, year round, anyway. A trip to Laramie would be a pleasure knowing that you were going to see 5 championship football games in a weekend.

I'm all for the state championship FB games being a multi-day event at a neutral site. For now, at least stager the game times (over multiple days) so a fan who is interested may possibly attend more than one game.

I am in favor of one venue 5 games two days.Although hosting a championship game is a boon to the community that hosts it,my biggest reason for a one venue event is the smaller schools will get the collage scouts viewing their athelets and just maybe somebody will get the oppertuinty for a d1 scholarship that would have went to somebody from a big school.I feel it affords the kids a few more oppertunites to showcase their talents.My 2 cents worth

I attending the 1A Championship game that was moved to Torrington (SE and GS) and have to say it was a disappointment because that wasn't SE's field or facilities. It just wasn't the same as being on your own field, in your community and at your school. Although--if given a chance to play at UW, I think these young men would gladly accept. What an awesome experience it would be! Why can't the WHSAA just try it? If it doesn't workout for whatever reason, at least we tried it. The way it is now, we'll never know.

I think you need to give it a couple years trial run. The reason being the first year your going to have hiccups, just like the state tournaments, they've had issues and then found an answer but it took a few tries to make it work. I know you hear the weather issue, but I would have to say if it's cold and snowing in laramie, chances are its cold and snowing at the other sites also.

People need to remember these are not pre-set locations. They are the locations in the event that the top two remaining teams have identical seeds. It's just that the number 1 seeds don't lose very much. Even last year in 4A, Jackson and Buffalo had tough semi-final games, but they still pulled it out. I for one love state championships at the high schools. I love War Memorial as well, but everyone seems to assume that it's a central location and it's "neutral". It's certainly not central. And as for being neutral, you're going to tell me that if a Cheyenne team and Evanston made it to the championship that it would be neutral? I'm not against trying it, but it's not a perfect plan. For the record, I am against trying it in Casper. If I"m driving 6 hours, I'd better be winding up at the War.

I don't like the idea of all the games being in one location. There is "no" truely neutral site. Yes we are use to traveling during the season and if it was changed, we would have made the trip. But, there is nothing like playing on your home field, in front of your community, family & fellow classmates (who possibly couldn't make a trip, not all schools will offer buses for travel to student body, especially 5 - 6 hours travel and lodging). The teams would have to make the adjustment of playing surfaces, so they would have to be there days early for the practice time, and that would mean missing even more days of school. My son was a Senior on the JHHS Championship Team, and to this day we still have community members coming up to us and talking about getting to see the game. Many of them would not have gotten to see the great game if it would have been anywhere else. When they come as far apart for a community, as was the case for us, they are a memory like no other. I love to watch high school football and will try to continue to make home games, but without a son playing I wouldn't make a trip out of town for a game. I wish all parents good luck with the upcoming years of sports in Wyoming with all the changes that are being talked about.

I know I am in the minority here and maybe I am a bit old fashioned but I would have to vote with GoOrange even though I suspect he/she is a Bronc fan from Jackson. LOL (Brave fan here). I played in 2 championship games in my day (leather helmets) but both were on the opponent’s home field. However I can still remember the excitement and pride that these communities exhibited in hosting the BIG game. It is an honor that even the most fortunate programs only get to have maybe once a decade. It just seems to me that the experience of hosting a state championship football game is much too valuable (maybe a once in a lifetime) of an opportunity for a community, not for monetary reasons for the local businessmen but for the Pride and enthusiasm it instills in the community. I say don’t sell out at any price!

CGOE and GoOrange, The fact of the matter is that both teams were both undefeated. There was nothing that Jackson or Buffalo did throughout the season to seperate themselves from one another throughout the season. Do you think Jackson wins the game if they travelled to Buffalo and played on their turf??? Cause I don't and believe that the consensus would be the same. Putting all games in one location, especially a venue the size of War Memorial, gives each game a sense of neutralness. Also, it wouldn't allow the home teams A.D. to pack biased fans around the opposing teams end zone and run around like a yahoo encouraging noise during a crucial 4th&goal at the end of the years biggest game...
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South Dakota and Nebraska do this and receive little negative feedback.

I'm a little torn on this one and see advantages to both. However, I've seen what hosting a state championship can do for a community as both a home fan and a visitor. It is one of the few things in this world that truly draw a community together, and do it without tragedy. The three championships we hosted here in the 1990's transformed this town into Red/Black/White mania with even the businesses getting into the act. And, though you didn't like to travel, it was always neat to follow the team when they had to go on the road for a championship and see the pregame hype and propaganda of the host team/town. I think it is football (and athletics) at its purest form.

I'm a football enthusiast, but in most years wouldn't drive very far to "just watch a championship". I have, however, attended championship games in the past that I thought would be a great matchup even though I had no allegiance to either team. So, putting them all in one location would not entice me to make the 3+ hour trip to Laramie. I DO think that it would help in getting some of these kids scouted by colleges and would be a great opportunity for the kids to play in our state's biggest venue.

I'm not totally opposed to moving it to one site, say the War, but I do have concerns about it. First and foremost, I think you lose that community pride thing and the chance for the WHOLE community to get involved and wrapped up in the event. And second, I could see the host site and the WHSAA turning the event into a cash cow for their pocket books, through gate prices, concessions, motel rates, accessory sales, etc etc.. then it becomes more about the event; and less about two teams going helmet to helmet on the field.

you got to be kidding the kids worked so hard over the year give them a reward and let them play on a D1 field. have the games on thurs, fri, see wyoming play on sat. they can workout in the IPF tour the rochelle center, team meeting rooms, weight rooms i still dont understand why the university has not taken advantage of the situation

Everyone's talking about how these games bring the home "community" together, and how it is so great for them. I've witnesed a game where the away team came in and blew the home team away. By the third quarter all of their fans except a few had basically left and it was on their field. The Jackson/Buffalo game is a perfect example of why it needs to be at a neutral site. Like JA said, both teams were undefeated, so what warents where the game should be played? It should have been at a neutral site to give each team the best possible chance to win the game. Im not saying that Buffalo would've won, but the fan advantage wouldn't have been there. And if the game would've played out the same way, I would bet most of the Jackson fans would still be talking about it today..

P.S. The best turf is not in Casper, and the best turf is now not in Laramie.... Although I don't think anyone would advocate that the games should be played on the best turf in Wyoming - in the un-finished Riverton stadium...

Wow, the 4A state championship game last year apparently is still an open wound for some of the fans. It's been brought up several times as the reason to move all the games to one "nuetral" site. Let's not kid ourselves; while there won't usually be a home field advantage, fans will still be able to argue "advantage". In the case of Jackson/Buffalo, the Jackson fans could argue they had to travel twice as far; and there will be a fan and distance advantage argument if Cheyenne meets Sheridan or Star Valley plays Rawlins. If this is the will of the people and players, do it for the right reasons.

I too have witnessed the home team getting blown away in the championship. But, it didn't dampen the community pride and enthusiasm leading up to the game and/or to the point they knew they were beaten. The thing is, had it been played at a neutral site, that team would have started the game with a "few fans" instead of the packed house that later left the game.

If nothing more, this topic brings about a lot of discussion.

Didn't the east host last year in 2A? Lusk had home field thrugh out. Big Horn was the 2 seed. They hosted.

Actually, Ted, the rule is that the hosting duties go to the conference that didn't host the championship game the previous year. Since Big Horn hosted the 2A title game last year, and Big Horn is in the West, the 2A East winner has the home-field advantage throughout. This year, 2A is the only class where the hosting duties didn't change.

--patrick

Hey, we're getting the nice turf too! I guess we can throw our hat into the hypthetical hosting game too. Although SV's not central.

There are lots of pros and cons here, but I will never forget that feeling when they played "We are the Champions" on the PA system in 2005. I can still see all the fans running on to the field and the boys jumping up and down and hugging each other. One of the organizations made signs for each player that were nailed up on the retaining wall at the end of the field. It was one of those magical years that culminated on the home field. For me personally, I'm glad it was in Sundance.

JA,
Not sure where you are from, but you don't need to attack AD's in this BLOG, that is not the discussion. Nor is "if, what's or maybe".....GoOrange and myself simply stated our thoughts regarding the topic, we didn't attack anyone.

JA,
Whay do you find it necessary to attack our AD in this BLOG? Did I miss something in Patricks posting that reference's him or anyone else showing pride/spirit for their team? This is not the place for you sore spot issues. GoOrange and myself simply stated our opion on the topic being disccused. We didn't throw in "what if's, maybe's or could have's" on a game that would have one state champion and one in 2nd place for the year. The game could have gone either way based on the high skill level of both teams. There are many additional issues that could be discussed, but as I stated earlier, this BLOG is not the place for it. Simply put, nothing will ever take away the feeling of winning a State Title on your home field. It would not be the same at the WAR or any other venue.

I realize that there are more and more schools getting pro turf fields, but in reality, the University of Wyoming has the only facility that could undertake this endeavor. I know that last year they were willing to donate timers, scorers, ticket sales, ticket takers, security, etc if the decision was made to host it. I am really sorry that I missed the Jackson vs. Buffalo game, but was able to see the exciting Big Horn vs. Riverside game, but I had to make that choice as to which one to see. I just think it would have been nice to have the opportunity to see both games at one site. Would love to see the WHSAA try it for a couple of years and see how it goes. It is not cast in stone. Last year Evanston had to travel to Cheyenne to play in the championship game. Would have saved 45 miles of travel if it had been played in Laramie. Just my opinion.

The fact is that fewer than a couple hundred people would actually drive hundreds of miles at $4+/gallon and $100+ rooms in Laramie to watch four/five games in a stadium that would look empty. If old coaches and players want to get together - go and watch the best of the best at the Shrine Bowl. Keep the championships local!

Does anyone know if the technology that is used to exchange game films between coaches via computers could be used to provide access to the masses. In other words, could state championships be filmed, then made available to watch on the internet. My daughter's basketball team made it to the NAIA National tournament this past season and I couldn't make it to the games but was able to watch it on my computer. The next best thing to being there. Just a thought. It would be neat to be able to watch the games from the comfort of my living room instead of sitting in blowing snow. Maybe the games could be on YOU TUBE. Just wondering.

Gridiron: Thanks for reminding me that I am officially an "old coach". Would still like to see all the championship games. Maybe with all the new mineral money, an indoor facility similar in size to the Holt Arena in Pocatello, ID could be built in the geographic center of the state to facilitate a common site for championship football games. But wait, that may be too much of an advantage to Riverton, Lander and Shoshoni. I hope the price of gas will not hurt the attendance at every other culminating event held at a single site.

Gridiron: when the games are moved to Laramie and your hometown team is playing for a state championship your telling me that your staying home because it might cost you a few $$$$. I really think it's coming and coming soon. The state tournaments in Casper have had record crowds now for how many years now???? Games in Casper or at a regional site for a few days doesn't stop to many people from coming. If my son/daughter was playing for a state championship in anything, I would drive, fly, hitchhike or whatever it took to get to the gamesite.

Time for my $.02:

Both sides have benefits and both sides have drawbacks. Personally, I'm torn between both sides.

BUT... The WHSAA had all but burned its bridge with UW. They sealed that a year ago when they voted to not accept bids for football, essentially sealing UW out of a process that couldn't even get started.

UW -- and AD Tom Burman -- gave its best possible pitch, and the WHSAA board of directors still said no thanks.

It's key to note that the WHSAA board didn't say no to UW. They said no to the entire bid process.

It was close. Remember, the vote was 9-8. Anything with a vote that close will likely come up again.

Just don't look for UW to lead that charge. It already did that once. Look what happened.

--patrick

Mick....At the state basketball playoffs TCT West was broadcasting their area team's games on the web. The camera man used to live in Sundance and in visiting with him he offered to broadcast our games, too. I'm sure there was a little red tape, but within 10 minutes it was happening. Many of us called back to Sundance to have people spread the word. I called my computer "geek" brother-in-law in Ohio and he hooked the feed up to their big screen TV. They said it was awesome. Many grandparents and siblings from near and far away got to see the kids play. They ended up broadcasting all 3 of our games. I would certainly think something like this would be workable for other games/sports.

Mick,
TCT West has been a leader in this for the last few years. I got to watch most of Rob's games at state this year because of it. We also had the first round playoff football game between Sundance and Riverside. I was told that all the 5A football game tapes would be put on the net and that is how the 5A would exchange game tape. The rest should be soon to follow. It would be nice to know the sights so we could see them also. Mick you answered the trivia question very quickly, but you have got to see alot of allstar games . good job!

Tct west has done a wonderful job of helping our kids here in the Big Horn Basin learn about the broadcasting buisness. We have several kids here at Burlington who could put on their own sports show, at least better than the one on KTWO last night, what in the world was going on there?
The kids here in town that play football, to a man, say they would love to play at the WAR, but if not there then at home. That's where the college is you know. A pep talk from some of the coaches, maybe some special social engagement or banquet, or some sort of Meet the Cowboys get together could go a long way to making this game pretty special for some kid. (just some ideas)
I played eight man and eleven man, coached some nine man(two championship games). it's all football and it's all fun, not very many of us are going to get to play for a championship but the one's that do should have it be as memorable as possible. I would sure drive to Laramie for the game, and if there was more than one, much the better.

Hey Ted, Thanks. I have been fortunate enough to watch a few all star games. Does TCT west archive the games. In other words are they still available to watch? I had seen the cameras at the games but I guess I thought it was for game films. Good luck to your son at Dickenson. I'm sure he'll do great.

Mick,
No they don't. It's up to the schools to do that. I have DVDs of our games but not anything else.
I don't think Basin has any archives. I don't have any basketball but I do have the football games.Good luck to both of your kids They will do just fine I'm sure.

GO Orange and CGOE - This is a blog about hosting the state football championships or having them played at a neutral site. JA simply stated some facts that were related to the 4A Championship game in Jackson. Prior to last years game, I was definitely for a neutral site. A person might have argued that I didn't want to make the 6 hour trip to Jackson. They are right! I didn't want to make that trip. I would have preferred to travel 4 hours to Laramie and had the "opportunity" to watch all 5 state title games. If you recall, there were some dandies.
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That being said, I really enjoyed the hospitality of the people of Jackson. We were welcomed when we walked into stores, restaurants, and bars. I felt very welcome!
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Now JA referred to some of the accomodations at the stadium. I have to believe that GoOrange and CGOE both were at the game. I am not certain who the official was, but some Bison fans were told they couldn't park in the front lot, and couldn't sit in the Grand stands. This is where the hospitality stopped. We had fans that tried to sit on the track on what I think is the west corner, and they were told they couldn't and that they had to stand along the fence. We were provided three small bleachers that we had to share with Jackson people. Moments later, the same gentlemen paraded a herd of Jackson fans and sat them on the track in front of the set of bleachers that were placed in the Northwest corner. These fans were not asked to sit on the track, so they stood up blocking the view of all the fans that drove 6 hours to watch the game. We had elderly that were seated on the first row of the bleachers for obvious reasons, that could no longer watch the game.
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That is the problem I have with someone hosting that didn't earn it. "Most" schools don't have the facilities to host this event. Jackson definitely doesn't.
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It seems that the event center and casper college get filled with no problem. I saw people from Jackson there during the Basketball tournament, a pretty good crowd as a matter of fact. And someone else is correct when they say this shouldn't be about "old Coaches" getting together. It should be about the "kids".
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I was fortunate enough to drive 6 hours to watch our team play a great game and come up inches short. I have no problem with that.

I am torn between where they should go. I do love it when we play a game here in town. I do want to say that when we played in Jackson we were treated the same way that Buffalo was when we went and played up there for a play off game.

Bison Fan and Bearcat Fan: Last year both of your teams were excellent. Looks like this year will be more of the same for the two of you. Hope you keep pushing for that neutral location come playoff time:-)

JA- I noticed you mentioned the Jackson AD. Would you be complaining about the AD if Buffalo had scored? Just curious.

Dusty, You don't happen to be related to Mr. Shockley the AD at Jackson High are you. It sounds as though the fans of Buffalo were not treated very well. Whether Buffalo had scored or not does not take away from the fact that they were treated poorly and the AD acted inappropriatly. I remember at a Volleyball tournament in Thermopolis a few years ago, the Jackson parents were terrible. They would yell when the opposing team's server was about to serve. Laugh at the misfortunes of the other teams players. I thought...what are the kids like if their parents are acting this way. Maybe the kids were as embarrassed as we were for them. It sounds like a trend in the Jackson area. Too bad.

Eagle fan, Yes, I am related...doesn't change a thing. Amazingly, I was at the Jackson/Buffalo game. Yes, we have had a few unruly parents in the past...which town could say there fans are always on their best behavior? I hope as an eagle fan you support the kids playing now, while not punishing them for a few "poor" fans from a "few" years ago.
Let's face it, the AD ran along the Jackson sideline and waved his hands in the air to get the Jackson crowd to make some noise. Once again, what is inappropriate about supporting your team? Were you there?

Lets think about the kids that have worked so hard throughout the season. I was one of them 5 years ago. Playing on a D1 field and all of the other perks from being at the Univeristy,ie. Joe Glenn, Cowboy Football team, Facilities, etc., would be the highlight of any young mans football career. And if any of those kids go on too play at the next level what a great starting point for that. I realize that it is not alot of fun driving across Wyoming in November, but we all do it during the winter months for basketball and Wrestling and the atmosphere in Casper is great. Just think about the amazing experience it would be for the kids, they ar ethe ones that have earned it.

Buffalo fans let it go, after looking at past championship game results you probably will not have to go to Jackson for another 20 years if the system stays the same. But, let Jackson's facilities or lack of be an example as to why it needs to go to a larger neutral site. I know Jackson isn't the only place that doesn't have the proper facilities to hold a large crowd for a championship game. I would be willing to bet if you asked all the teams that played in the championship games this past year if there was enough and proper seating space they would all say "no".

With all that money up in Teton County you would think they would be able to put together a decent cheer squad composed of high school students. And on the line do you think i would feel the same about the AD if we would've won? Yes! It may not have been as big of a deal, but the fact that the guy showed such unprofessionalism in where buffalo fans could park, sit, stand, etc. is something that would've been an issue regardless of the outcome.

I'll be interested to see if Jackson can gather a crowd remotely the size of last years championship game with the loss of so many key contributers. I played on a team in high school that won very little, but always seemed to have the bleachers full come Friday night. It was amazing how fans showed up in support even though the program wasn't winning. There was NO fair-weatheredness about that program!

Dusty, it does mean a thing. You are, rightfully so, bias by your relationship. One of the duties of an AD, or any administrator is to keep fans from becoming unruly or get out of hand. Based on Bison fan's blog it seems that there were extreme prejudice towards Buffalo. Although there is a "host" and a visitor, the seating accommodations should have been set up with equal room for both patrons. Most of the ADs I have been associated with are usually in the background and only become vocal when fans get out of hand. It may have been less of a big deal if perhaps a mascot, if you have one, had ran up and down the sidelines. Or if the team itself made the gestures to make some noise, but the AD should really have stay out of it. By the way, I do support the kids playing now, who are we to "punish" kids who out there playing their hearts out because their parents are idiots. I just think its a shame that what I witnessed even happened.

I can understand the complaints about our facility, but we are not the only ones in the state. Our's was not ready to host an event and there was not enough time to make all possible corrections. Come on when you host one every 20 years everything isn't going to be perfect! Our AD and support staff spent many hours doing what could be done to accomodate the 5000 fans anticipated to attend. The field looked awesome!!! Thanks guys!!! Bleachers were borrowed from all over the valley and as far away as Star Valley. What could be done was done.....

When fans were allowed on the track I will agree with you on mistakes being made. But please know it wasn't meant to disrupt anyone. I had people telling me how they were unable to see the game and they were on the track on the Jackson side. It wasn't the best solution for our seating problem, but was an attempt. I will agree with the discussion at hand based on this issue alone that a site such as UW would be nice. But, sure did enjoy hosting it this year, no matter what!!!!!!

Our parking mess is something we have been dealing with for many years. With the success of our football program this year this issues and others are being reviewed and let's hope we will see corrections in coming years.

Regarding comments on "treatment of fans".....Can you all honestly say that your fans have "NEVER" behaved in a poor manner? I agree we have had ours and a time or two I was one of them. Not proud of this by any means, it is very embarassing when I look back on it, but at least I'm honest. I have traveled alot in the past 8 years with my daughter (cheerleading) and my son (football, basketball & track) and can recall "poor manners" at every school one time or another. So, "NO ONE" should be throwing this at any other school.......

I no longer have a student in any Wyoming school, but have enjoyed these past years, the good times far outweight the bad. I have met many wonderful people and have fond memories to last a life time. I will continure to attend "home" events and support JHHS athletics, WIN or LOSE.....2007/2008 will be a school year not soon forgotten...GO BRONCS!!!

CGOE, I think my son had the pleasure of playing with your son Daniel at the shrine bowl last month. If all the students in Jackson acted with class as he did, then everything will be fine. My son is Rob Johnson. Good luck to Daniel.

Thank you Mick. Daniel is my son and I'm glad he represented Jackson in a positive manner. Rob had a great game, and was fun to watch. Daniel will be off to Carroll College in 3 weeks and will start a whole new chapter of football!!! Hope Rob enjoys his coming year and best of luck to him as well.

I'm not sure what relationship money has to a cheerleading squad or how behavior at a volleyball tournament "a few years ago" plays into a football hosting discussion, but I guess this has turned into a Jackson bash-fest so logic need not apply.

Getting back on topic, I support a neutral site for football championships just like most other sports use in their state tournaments. Yes, there's some loss to individual communities but the overall experience of playing at War Memorial in front of an even larger audience would be worth it for the players. And this coming from someone from Jackson? Say it ain't so!

wyofloater, This isn't a Jackson bash-fest. I think what some people were talking about were a "pattern" of behavior with adults and student/athletes. I don't believe that Patrick's original topic mentions anything about a neutral site so I don't see where they are "off topic". I am sure that all of the readers here have been waiting with baited breath for your opinion. It sounds as though you are speaking for all the players here in Wyoming. What a heavy load that must be. By the way, I think I left a wyofloater in my toilet this morning.

Classy, big fan, real classy.

You've set a fine example of how to comment on the subject of the post instead of simply making spurious ad hominem attacks.

Wyofloater and big fan, It appears that both of you want to be able to share your opinions but not allow anyone else to do so. wyofloater it appears you didn't see the point of the fans not behaving properly so you assume its a Jackson bashing and logic need not apply. Did I accuse you of making spurious ad hominem attacks...NO. Big Fan, although I found the toilet comment somewhat amusing, it was perhaps a little out of line. Finally, wyofloater, your last comment didn't make a whole lotta sense to this country boy; Spurious (false) and ad hominem (against the man). Can his (or her) opinion be false if it is indeed an opinion?

Well, eagle fan, the answer to your question is yes. But your comments are reasonable enough that we can have a discussion like adults so I'll try my best to make a coherent point or two and then I'll bow out and leave you guys to it.

1. As I understand it, the point of this blog is for Patrick to raise interesting topics which we are then free to comment on. I don't think Patrick intended to provide a forum for us to attack each other and/or our communities but I'll be happy to let him weigh in on that.

2. The topic of this post is "Football hosting". Unlike big fan, I and others think the idea of neutral sites falls under this topic. The topic of fan & parent behavior is largely a different one even though they can be related.

I think your references to some Jackson parents as "terrible" and "idiots" is as uncalled for as big fan's potty humor. But that's just my opinion (which can't be wrong, right?)

Well, wyofloater, you are correct that the topic of the post is "Football hosting" but nowhere in the post does it mention the idea of neutral sites. One's assumption that the post solicits comments about a neutral site is out of order here. I think the diehard HS fan's blog kind of started people talking about it. Which is fine. I thought that topic had been talked about previously and settled that it "aint going to happen". Secondly... if an opinion is formed based on your perception, and your perception is your interpretation of a truth, then can your opinion ever be "wrong" or refuted? So is the answer to my question really yes?

The references to the 4A game in Jackson and the conduct of some fit nicely into this forum. Those are all points favoring/or opposing a neutral site for football. The WHSAA has rules forwhat fans can and can not do, bring, etc to culminating events.
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Some fans/administrators do things that make them vulnerable to the critics, others don't!

Wow, I'm glad this blog is still alive and well although it does seem that the same subjects keep rearing their ugly heads. Anyone who has followed these comments over the last year or so already knows that I'm all for the championship games at the war so I won't even waste my time addressing this. I'm just glad to now be coaching in a state where this subject has been addressed years ago.....and guess what gridiron....a lot more than a couple of hundred fans show up in Salt Lake and Cedar City for the games. I do find it interesting that Eagle Fan has appointed his or herself as the judge of good and bad behavior in Wyoming high school athletics. I would be interested to know where they are from and then ask some of the schools in their area if they have witnessed any of these acts of "not behaving properly," by their fans.
The truth is that it happens at every school to some degree, so to pretend that you are somehow the moral authority on this subject is laughable. Although, I've never been a big Jackson fan and have always had a lot of respect for the programs in Buffalo, it seems to me this is a simple case of crying over spilt milk. YOU LOST.....deal with it and come back and kick their butts this year. Although I've always thought Shawn was a bit of a winer as a basketball coach, the fact is the guy is one hell of a coach....and no matter if you like him or not, you should darn well respect him and the job he does. As far as getting his crowd pumped up in that situation.....good for you coach. There should be a lot more administrators that demonstrate that degree of passion and school spirit. A lot of these guys now are so busy trying to put on the "I'm a professional show," that they forget to be emotional leaders to the athletic programs in their schools. It's ok to get emotionally involved, and when you do the kids love you for it. There's an old theory in coaching that I believe in strongly. It states that kids take on the personality of their coach. I think an AD can play the same role and be a leader for the entire student body

Wow Mike Walk, we sure have missed you here in Wyoming. We've read all about the folks here in Lyman and how they are losers and your ex-assistant coaches, how they were spineless and that that was a direct reflection on the players... and now you have the audacity to say that someone has appointed him or herself as a judge of good or bad behavior? You write on these blogs as if someone really cares about your opinion more than someone else's. After getting fired from a coaching job because the school board kept getting complaints about you really gives little credibility to your thoughts on any subject. I guess "they" were the judge of bad behavior in Lyman, Wyoming high school athletics. Don't mean to come down so hard on you Mike but over the past year or so, I've found your opinions...Laughable.

First of all eagle fan you should get your facts straight before you say things on here. I honestly thought this eagle fan was from Tongue River from some of the other comments in the past. I want you to show me where I called the people in Lyman losers. As far as the complaints about me to the school board, nobody ever told me that....that's good to finally here from someone. If this is true, it tells me the school board was listening to some of these people instead of referring them to the coach, then the AD, and on up the chain of command which I thought was board policy. Maybe I'm wrong I don't know, but it sure would have been nice to have had the opportunity to address some of the problems at the time, as I'm sure was intended when the policy was implemented. All I knew was that we had won the conference championship the year before, graduated 5 all-state linemen, and still made the playoffs my last year. My ex-assistant coaches spineless? Did I say that? I called people that don't use their names on here when they criticize spineless. I don't recall saying that about my assistants but maybe I did. If I did I apologize. I do recall using the word 'lazy' on here about some of them. I've talked with them about that since so I don't feel the need to address it here. Look, some time has passed, and no doubt, some mistakes were made on both sides. I hope Lyman does well. I graduated from Lyman and the reason I got into coaching in the beginning was because I didn't like watching them lose to Mt. View 66-0. I still have a lot of friends back in Wyoming and a great many of my former players stay in touch with me. I like to hear what you and everyone else has to say on this blog and I try to learn from some of the criticism. One thing I think I can say to you is to listen to some of the people outside of Lyman that aren't necessarily your friends and ask them what their opinion is about a lot of the fans in Lyman. You might be surprised at some of the responses. Don't get me wrong...most of the people in Lyman are great people...but don't act like you don't have the same problems with a few as they do in Jackson. I was talking to one well known person there in Lyman about the way things used to be back in the 70's and 80's. He said around the state people respected Lyman for the way they conducted themselves on and off the field of play. He said not just players, but coaches, administrators, and fans. His exact words were, "the people in town don't realize that we've changed in some peoples eyes." Now Lyman is no different than any other school when it comes to this. The fact is that the atmosphere around high school athletics as a whole has changed. In talking with a lot of people six miles away from you guys, the problem isn't that some Lyman people get a little unruly like everyone else; it's just that many of you act like your above it, and that is doesn't go on in Lyman too. That was the attitude I fealt in your comment about Shockley and that's why I responded. The problem is that there are some that are under the delusion that it's different there. So my point in the statement above was simply not to judge Jackson when bad behavior is present everywhere....yes, even in Lyman. Now as far as you opinions about me....I really don't care if you like me or not. I just wish you had the guts to put your name by your comments.

Wow, Eagle fan two days and no response. The way you jumped on my first comment I thought I would have heard from you much sooner. If you don't want to use your real name I understand.....that would take guts. I've talked to several of my friends back in Lyman (yes, contrary to what you thought I still have quite a few) and we can't quite figure out who you are. You, called yourself a country boy so that gave us a few ideas, but you write too well to be any of the people we came up with. Oh well, if you don't respond good luck to your Eagles this season. Maybe next year we can get you on our schedule....that would make things interesting wouldn't it.

Wondering which one of Walk's "friends" really is "eagle fan"!

I wondered that myself JustWonder. lol

Hello, long time no talk. Glad football is on the way. Mike Walk, where are you coaching in Utah?
I enjoy the big state title games in Salt Lake and Cedar City, and would be in favor of games at War Memorial. But I also love the feel of a home field that a town has embraced and built by tradition. Each side has a valid point, the State Title games are important, hopefully we can get resolve to the missue.

Hey JS96, Glad to see you back on here. I'm coaching in Monticello, Ut. It's a school about the same size as Lyman, Mt. View, and Kemmerer. We actually came up over the summer and did some 7 on 7 with those three schools. It was a lot of fun. Kemmerer looks like they are loaded again....but we already knew that didn't we. You guys make sure you keep me posted on what's going on in Wyoming's rugged 3a West Black and Blue division. If I were a betting man, I'd put my money on yet another state championship trophy coming to that little corner of the state....probably to Kemmerer. I do think Glenrock and Mt. View will have something to say about it though.